Tuesday, April 17, 2007

For All you MTT Experts out there.. Quick Question

A rare 2nd post of the day...

So as I mentioned earlier, I have been watching some MTT hand histories via PXF hand history tool. Again, these histories are available at 2+2 in the MTT forum . This particular hand was very, very interesting to me.. You don't have to be a PXF subscriber; but you do need a free login and password.

So let's set it up. We are watching a $109 6 man tourney on FTP. The guy we are watching is a guy that is up there on the pocketfives leaderboard. In other words, the boy can play and the buyin is high enough to have generally good play. We are at hand 152 of the tournament with blinds at 150 and 300. We are in the SB...

Stack Sizes go like this:

UTG: 11264
Hijack: 4693
Cutoff: 5650
Button: 1845
SB (us): 14275
BB : 26830

We get dealt Qh7c.

Obviously nothing to exciting and most likely will let it go; but UTG and HJ call so he makes the call and the BB checks so we are 4 handed. I don't have any reall problems there.

Flop comes: 9hJhTh

Not a bad flop giving us an open ended straigh flush draw. What is your move?

He checks. I certainly don't mind that as you want somebody to lead into you (or so I think). Well, the BB obliges and leads out 300 into a 1200 pot... HJ then bumps it to 800.

Now what do you do.. It's going to cost you 800 into 2300 pot.

Again, this player, is much, much better than me. Do you just call getting almost 3-1 or are you ready to get your chips in the middle as quick as possible.

Here is what I probably would have done... I would have re-bumped to 1800-2000. My feelings is that I can't get my chips in the middle fast enough and if my raise scares people off... so be it.

Well, he folded... which is the point of this post. As we all know, I am a documented donkey (and no I don't have a problem being called that... it is what it is )... How do you not at least call this?

Well, let's proceed on... remembering.. decisions not results... BB called the raise...

Turn cards came.... 6s

BB checked and HJ bet 1200 and got called by the BB.

River... 7h... BB now leads out 1200 into the 5200 pot and gets called. and the BB turns over Jc8h for the striaght flush.... so he obviously would have taken a bunch of our chips... although not all of them most likely as you would have probably just called with a Qh flush.. or even folded it then... not likely raising as it was definitley a call me type bet.

I would appreciate any thoughts on this hand..

BTW, this guy went on to win the thing... so obviously worked out for him.


TripJax said...

With a quick 1st glance, I'm not sure I get away from that hand...

I probably call and then jam the turn no matter what it is...

pokerpeaker said...

I don't think I could get away from it either. And I'm kinda tight!

It's great to have you back, man. Keep it up!

StB said...

I would have played it the same way you were thinking. I am bumping it up on the flop. At the very least I am seeing the turn.

HighOnPoker said...

I would've gotten away from the hand. This is related to your next post on whether you have to be lucky to win a tournament. Part of MTT strategy should be minimizing the role of luck, which in this case means folding in a tough position. The SB is out of position, with a straigh flush draw, but he could be facing a stronger heart (Kh, Ah), in which case, he is screwed if he hits his flush. He may hit his straight, but considering that he is out of position, I wouldn't worry much about the straight. This all assumes that someone hasn't already flushed, in which case, the chance of making the Q-high flush has dropped significantly and you might be facing a superior flopped flush anyway. Now add into the fact that he has a lot of chips relative to the other players, and he can fold out of position with relative ease. Does this make sense? In the heat of the moment, a call or a re-raise might seem good, but really, this drawing hand doesn't have that great potential with the other players in the hand.

Oh, and I wrote about de-lucking tournaments here, if you are interested: http://highonpoker.blogspot.com/2006/03/de-lucking-sngs.html

Alan said...

I'm certainly a tournament donk myself but I would fold here too. This is one of those enticing flops but in the end, you are still drawing and you are drawing to a 3rd best flush unless you hit your straight flush. But if you're drawing to the straight flush, you only have 2 outs. With a raise, it's very likely that the guy as an ace of hearts. In which case, even if he doesn't have the flush yet, you really have very few outs. I hate pushing if I have very little chance to improve. I think there are two sides to chip accumulation... actually accumulating chips AND protecting the chips you have. Gambling here means you're definitely trying to get lucky instead of trying not to be unlucky. Pushing with a dominant favorite = trying not to get unlucky. Pushing with fold equity plus maybe catch a draw = trying to get lucky.

That's just my opinion for what it's worth... from one tournament donk to another. :)

Btw, I'm just discovering this blog. Nice site you have here!

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